The toast of Chicago punk rock, The Lawrence Arms, recently celebrated their tenth anniversary. They of course did so in style, by playing a commemorative show at the Metro and releasing their first seven-inch. We met up with singer/bassist Brendan Kelly in late December of ’09 and discussed a great deal of the band’s decade-long history. We talked about record label dealings, tour stories, the future of the band and more.

Bill – Looking back on the early days of the band, did you ever envision that you guys would still be together ten years later?

Brendan – It’s funny because one of the first songs that we ever wrote was “The North Side, the L&L and Any Number of Crappy Apartments,” with a chorus that says, “Where will you be in ten years?” Sort of the punchline in the song is, “Hopefully I won’t be here” and well, here we are, (laughs). So, I think it’s safe to say I have documented evidence that we didn’t think we’d still be around ten years later. As it’s gone on, it’s been a much cooler thing than I ever anticipated it would be and I don’t have a single regret from these ten years or this band. It’s like, what more could I ask for? We’ve made one of my favorite records of all-time with Oh! Calcutta! and I’m just so happy with what we’ve done. We’re not the coolest band in the world, we’re not the most awesome dudes in the world or anything like that, but we are best friends and we are the music that we set out to make. I’ve got a lot of friends who’ve had careers for ten years that are probably paying off a little better right now than mine, but I’m pretty stoked on where we’re at.

Bill – What are some of your fondest memories from the band’s first year or so of existence?

Brendan – First year or so, geez. What did we do then? I remember calling Neil from a payphone in the student union of my college and leaving a message on his answering machine. I mean, this is so archaic at this point. The message said, “Neil, I want to talk to you. I’m going to change your life.” That was the message I left him. I was calling because I wanted him to play drums in a band that I was going to start, which was The Lawrence Arms. I think about that all the time, because I said that kind of off-the-cuff, as like a hilarious joke. I have a flair for the dramatic and stupid, but I think about it sometimes and I’m like, “I really did change his life with that phone call,” (laughs). It’s pretty hilarious. Those first years, that’s what it was. It was payphones, answering machines and practice spaces. I remember we recorded A Guided Tour of Chicago in a day and we ran out of money, so we couldn’t get it mixed. It just came out the way it was, a rough mix. We recorded Ghost Stories six months later. I was reading The Death of Ivan Ilyich under the fuckin’ mixing board, because I had a paper due the next day. I wrote the paper in the studio while we were mixing and I was just like, “Yeah, that’s cool, sounds good.” That first year was about as nerdy as people would hope for from a band like us, very studious and scholarly.

Bill – Early on, your band played virtually every weekend in and around Chicago. Whether it was a college classroom, suburban bookstore or church basement, the venue and number of people there didn’t seem to matter. What was some of the thinking behind that approach and how did it help you guys to become a better live band?

Brendan – Well, it’s like when you start out you’ve kind of got to get your name out there, you know? The only way to do that is to get in front of people. There’s no way to become a popular act without getting in front of people. If you look at a band like The Gaslight Anthem, I think they’re a perfect example of this, where somebody’s like, “Those guys just blew up out of nowhere.” They didn’t. They toured and traveled and played in front of no one forever and ever. Yeah, it was only three years, but that’s still three years of playing in front of nobody. If you have the ability to travel around the country and do that, you travel around the country and do that. We were locked-in to Chicago, so we played here, which reminds me of another favorite memory from the early years of our band. We played this show, it was like our 17^th show and I was sitting on the curb next to this kid and he’s like, “That was alright.” The kid was like 16 or 17 and I’m like 21 at the time. He’s like, “You guys are alright, you’re not bad.” I’m like, “Thanks, dude.” Then he’s like, “You guys ever gonna go on tour? You ever think about that?” I was like, “That’ll always be the dream,” (laughs). He said something and anyways, the result was that The Broadways came up. I was like, “Oh, I was actually in that band.” He goes, “You were? Dude, Brendan’s a good friend of mine,” (laughs). I was sitting on a curb with about eight people on either side of me and the collective snort that came out of everybody right as he said that was so unbelievable. It’s probably the best memory that I have of being in The Lawrence Arms.

Bill – That’s pretty hilarious. For a long time, The Lawrence Arms seemed to exist in the shadow of your two previous bands, Slapstick and The Broadways. At what point do you feel like The Lawrence Arms stepped into its own light?

Brendan – The Greatest Story Ever Told was the hands-down difference. It’s hard to make a grandiose statement because it’s not like we’re a gigantic force to be reckoned with now, but nobody believed in our band before The Greatest Story Ever Told. I remember this fuckin’ festival we played in Massachusetts where we got laughed off the stage. It was unbelievable. We were playing with Thursday and the new incarnation of Weston and all these emo bands. We got onstage and I mean we were young. This was right when our split with Shady View Terrace was about to come out. Shady View Terrace, for example, was hugely popular. We get to the stage and it was me and Chris, and we both had long hair and hats with the brims flipped up. I was dressed kind of like I am now, but scummier. The first song we played was “A Toast” and when it got to the guitar solo the crowd laughed, laughed like it was a comedy act. They were like, “This isn’t music. Music is crying.” The entire beginning of our band was fighting so hard against the grain because what we were doing wasn’t cool. Our reviews were so dismissive and that’s fuckin’ fine. I think there’s a lot of pertinence to the criticisms of those early records because they’re not that good. I remember the review in Alternative Press of Apathy and Exhaustion. It said something like, “A pop punk band with two singers. Whatever, it works for Less Than Jake and it works for Alkaline Trio.” It was like, “You think we sound like Less Than Jake and Alkaline Trio?” Both are totally awesome bands, but they’re not even in the same ballpark. Same genre yeah, but it’s not the same ballpark. We’re doing something I think totally different than both those bands. Those two bands are doing something totally different from each other. It’s insulting on three different fronts, (laughs). That was always what it was, like “These guys are doing this woefully out of touch, bullshit style of music that nobody gives a shit about.” When we put out The Greatest Story Ever Told, all of sudden a couple people, against their better judgment, put us on a few year-end lists and reviewed the record positively. Since then it’s been like a fuckin’ snowball. Now our last record, the reviews across the board have been awesome. I don’t feel like any of that shit has anything to do with the quality of music we put out. Before that, people were motherfucking us because it was hip to motherfuck us. Now, people are giving us props because it’s hip to give us props, you know? I guess I take it all with a grain of salt, but yeah, that was definitely a turning point.

Bill – After releasing your first two albums on Asian Man Records, you followed with two split releases, (one with Shady View Terrace, as previously mentioned, and another with The Chinkees). At this point, you guys experienced a sizeable growth in popularity and also began attracting interest from several larger record companies. What did you find most exciting or surprising regarding this period in your band’s career?

Brendan – That was a super-exciting time. I think the big thing was that it was obviously back in the days when the idea of being in a band was a sustainable living. When we did the split with The Chinkees, we were all of a sudden talking to a lot of different people about it. That was when we ended up talking to the dudes from Vagrant, Fat and Grand Royal. When we talked to the guys from Grand Royal, we were doing a one-week stint on Warped Tour. The guy from Grand Royal was like, “Hey, I want these dudes to come and see you.” He got us on for the Chicago date of Warped Tour, at like a prime time, prime stage. It was right when the Chinkees split had come out and it was probably the biggest show we had played at the time. The Chicago date specifically was really, really packed and hot. One of my best friends has no sweat glands, which is hilarious by the way, but he couldn’t even stay there. There was no water anywhere to be seen, no shade anywhere and they were just like bringing ambulances in and out. It was pretty upsetting to me, especially because I put this personal face on it because of my friend. Granted he’s got a fucked up physical condition because he’s inbred or whatever, (laughs) but the fact is that when we got onstage, I was pretty upset. Gary Gersh and John Silva, who were the two heads of Grand Royal, and Mike D, were probably some of the most important people in all of rock ‘n’ roll at the time and they were there to see us. All the people from the Warped Tour were there with them. I got onstage and said something to the effect of, “Hey, you know what, man? We’re really glad to be here, but this is overcrowded, it’s very hot, there’s no water or shade. We’re really sorry, there’s ambulances coming in and out of here, and this is complete bullshit. Next time we play in Chicago it’s going to be inside, the show’s gonna be five bucks and the water’s gonna be free, I promise.” According to the ten messages I had on my cell phone when I got off the stage that day, those dudes left right then. They turned to Kevin Lyman, (Warped Tour founder) who was hanging out with them and they said, “Wow, sounds like this guy’s not gonna play the Warped Tour anymore, huh?” He said “yep” and they left. They didn’t even watch our band and that was it. That was our flirtation with success. If you want to look at the fuckin’ moment that the penny dropped in my life, that was the difference between being a bartender and a celebrity. I’m a bartender, (laughs).

Bill – Wow. That’s a pretty incredible story. What ultimately led you guys to partner with Fat Wreck Chords?

Brendan – Mike called me and it’s exactly the same as the story that’s inside that Wrecktrospective CD. I was at work and Mike called me up and he goes, “Hey, this is Fat Mike. I like your band and I want to do a record.” I was like, “That would be great. I would love that.” He’s like, “So, we’ll give you like some money to record.” I was like, “Oh yeah? Awesome. Cool. Yeah, totally.” He’s like, “Alright. How you doing? Good?” I say “yeah” and he’s like, “Alright, alright, I gotta go. Bye.” I hung up the phone and went back in and was like, “Gary, I quit” and I walked out of the record store. It was this sweet moment because there was this shoe store right next door where all these hot chicks worked with a big picture window. I walked by them every day on my way to and from work. I opened the door and looked in and I went, “I quit my job” and they just kind of stared at me, (laughs). Why did we sign with Fat Wreck Chords? Because I grew up thinking that Fat Mike was the coolest dude in the world and he called me on the phone one day and that was it. He’s my friend now, but I’m still a fan and I’m still dorky around him. He asks me questions about things that I do and we can talk like friends, but it’s not ever really going to be like that. He’s cooler than me and I accept that.

Bill – Of your three full-lengths on Fat, which is your favorite and why?

Brendan – Oh! Calcutta! because it’s the record I’ve been dying to hear forever. When we made it, it was just so fun and awesome. That whole record is about the three of us kind of all hugging together. Making it was like that too. It’s like the fuckin’ pink shit in Ghostbusters II. You spray that over people and they just get happy. Making a record about how much you love the guy you’re standing across from, you start to love them even more. We obviously have always all gotten along really well, but you stand there for fuckin’ 45 days with a microphone facing someone else and sing a song about how much you love them, tell me you don’t love them a little more after the end of it. It was a great experience to make that record. It’s my favorite one to listen to and my favorite one that I’m a part of. If I were to die with no other musical output I’m stoked.

Bill – Tell me about the decision to release a new seven-inch in conjunction with your ten-year anniversary show at Metro.

Brendan – The seven-inch is just more a product of the fact that we hadn’t done shit in so long. I had a kid, Chris’s old lady moved here, we got jobs and the music industry died. A lot of things transformed after we made the last record and really it was a pragmatic decision that was like, “Man, we haven’t done shit in a while.” Based on the fact that we had all these new sorts of mistresses for lack of a better word, we were unable to just sit around and get drunk and write music all the time. We only had a couple songs. We came up with the idea of just doing a seven-inch and were like, “Ah, it would be cool to do a seven-inch. It would be better than nothing, obviously.” That’s when Neil was like, “Dude, we should call it ‘Buttsweat and Tears.’” In like 1999, we decided that our first seven-inch was going to be called “Buttsweat and Tears,” but we never ended up making a seven-inch. We just did full-length after full-length. When he said that, we were just like, “Dude!” I mean, he brought up a joke that was dormant for ten years. It’s hard to explain now because it’s been out in press releases like, “This was the idea for a record for ten years.” But that second that Neil goes, “We should call this record ‘Buttsweat and Tears,’” Chris and I had not heard that term in ten years and it was just awesome. I think that pretty much sums it up.

Bill – Lyrically speaking, Buttsweat and Tears is somewhat depressing. The songs talk about getting older, broken dreams, regret, missed opportunities and so on. Where exactly do these songwriting motivations come from?

Brendan – When we wrote Oh! Calcutta!, that was like 2004 and 2005. That was a different time and again, now I’m a full-time bartender. Music used to be a sustainable business, but it’s not anymore. Besides that, we’re older and I have a family. We’ve all got responsibilities and stuff like that. I would hate to say that there’s anything on the record about regret. That’s something consciously that I think Chris and I both try to avoid talking about, because I think it’s very poisonous and unhealthy. It’s definitely a time now for reflection. We lived awesome youths and now we’re done with that. There’s something to be said for that. I mean, it’s not easy to take in all the time, you know? When you’re young everything’s always easy and one day you wake up and it’s hard and the entire world has passed you by. It’s crazy. That’s been sort of the inspiration for me. I guess I wrote four of the five songs, so I can speak pretty confidently about it.

Bill – In some ways, Buttsweat and Tears sounds like a love letter to the city of Chicago. What about this city is so endearing that it continually plays such a prominent role in your songs?

Brendan – This is where we’re from, man. This town, for lack of a better phrase, is like a harsh reality. One second, it’s 115 degrees and then it’s 30 below. It affects us so hard, from the way you live your life to the way you think to your day-to-day existence. I remember the other day my mom had my kid and she was like, “Well, we’re not gonna go out today, it’s too cold.” They reduced their day to spending it inside the two-bedroom apartment where my mom lives. It’s just so informative of every aspect of your life that it can’t help but be informative of your creative or artistic output. This town is the biggest city that’s not New York. I mean L.A. is technically bigger, but it’s not a city either. It’s so harsh in terms of the weather and so underappreciated. Everybody here has this sort of stepchild complex. Everybody here is what The Lawrence Arms is to Alkaline Trio, (laughs). That’s probably why we sound like Chicago, we are Chicago. The Alkaline Trio is New York and we’re Chicago. And Rise Against is L.A., (laughs).

Bill – That’s pretty great. Does the song “Demons” in any way reference an actual wedding?

Brendan – It does, but I wasn’t at the wedding. It references my friend Sean, who’s been our merch guy forever and he’s one of my best friends. I actually write about him extensively on my blog. His name is Sean Nader. Apparently, he went to a wedding and so did his buddy, Jimmy Lucido, who’s the drum tech for Chris Cornell’s solo project, by the way, (laughs). Anyway, by the time everybody got to the reception, which was at like noon, they were shirtless, walking around and ready to fight people. It got pretty ugly after that. The thing about Sean is that he’s an amazing visual artist. He’s a painter and he’s brilliant. I have one of his pieces in my house and I would pay any amount of money for anything that he does. He’s brilliant. He also likes to get down. He likes to party. He lives it so fully and so viscerally that he’s just a huge inspiration to me in every way. The way he lives his life, he’s just one of the most kickass people of all-time. He also happens to be a brilliant artist and that’s really important to me. Not to extrapolate and really get off on a topic that may or may not be meaningful, but I have a friend named Eric who has a Fine Arts degree from the University of Boulder. When he graduated from college, they had this show with all the Fine Arts grads. It was in a gallery or whatever. At the end of the night, in front of Eric’s exhibit there were these crushed beer cans and a passed-out dude. The rest of it was like a normal art gallery, but he brought in this unruly element where all of a sudden there was a mess that needed to be cleaned up. A dude had pissed himself and passed out and all these cans of Schlitz were strewn about. Ever since that moment he’s epitomized to me what I think is important about art. That’s what makes him the best artist in that class. He’s the one that lives it viscerally. Nader is the exact same thing. He’s got his shirt off at the wedding reception, telling motherfuckers to go fuck themselves. That’s what drives his art, you know? That’s what I strive for. I’m not as cool as either of those dudes. I wish to god I was and I try to ape them as much as I possibly can. Those two guys are endless sources of inspiration for me. That’s what that song is about, Sean Nader at a wedding and I’m putting myself in his shoes.

Bill – Growing up in the Chicago music scene, it’s probably every kid’s dream to headline a show at the Metro. What did you enjoy most about your 10^th anniversary show there?

Brendan – My favorite moment of the 10^th anniversary show was walking into the Gingerman about an hour before we were supposed to load-in. I walked in the door and the whole place burst into applause. Upon looking around, there were people from all over the world in there. There were Europeans, Australians, New Zealanders, people from Texas. It was crazy. Not a lot of people can say they do something that brings people from all over the world together. I know in theory that people listen to my music all over the world, but to see it in one room, and it wasn’t the room I was playing in. That was the key thing. It was just a random spot. It’s up there with my wedding day as far as the best moments of my life. It’s very humbling and it kind of even makes me teary to talk about it now. That was the coolest.

Bill – I can imagine. It definitely sounds like it. Tell me about your subsequent tour of Arizona and California that followed your 10^th anniversary show.

Brendan – The tour was awesome. The whole thing was sold-out, I mean we played in small rooms, so it wasn’t terribly surprising that it sold-out, but it was fuckin’ awesome. It was just great to be back on the road. I got to stay in the guy from Nine Inch Nails’ house and I went to a barbeque at the guy from Foo Fighters’ house. We got to pretend that we were rock ‘n’ rollers for a second, which was pretty neat. The remarkable thing about touring now is how much we all get out of situations as fast as we can. There used to be stories every night, and now it’s just like, “Well, there’s probably gonna be a story tonight. I gotta get out of here before the story.” We’re old men now. When I’m at home I go to bed at 9:00 PM.

Bill – The Lawrence Arms has done more than its fair share of touring over the years, both nationally and internationally. Do you have a favorite country to play or is there a particular band that you like touring with most?

Brendan – My favorite country or continent to play is Australia. Australia is amazing. It’s unbelievable how livable it is and how the government is actually set up to make the citizenry happy. It’s a true model of how the world should be run. If you ever want to know what’s wrong with America, spend a week in Australia and you won’t even have to consciously think about it, you’ll know. There’s a ton of bands I could mention, but my favorite tour I’ve probably ever been on was the tour we did with Hot Water Music. I really felt, and I can’t speak for those guys, but I really felt we had come together and made it an “us against the world” kind of thing. We were playing second out of four, so this was a while ago. The third band was A Static Lullaby and These Arms Are Snakes opened. On that tour, I remember us and the Hot Water guys just really developing this “us against the world” mentality and fuck everybody. If nobody comes to the show, fuck it. If everybody comes to the show, fuck it. It’s us and this is what’s important. It was that sort of attitude that led into the recording of Oh! Calcutta!. It was the inspiration for that entire record, that sort of brotherhood that was founded on that tour. We played the Hot Water Music reunion show and I said onstage, and it was quoted on Punk News, that I wouldn’t still be in a band if it weren’t for their Caution album and the song “Trusty Chords.” It’s not just idle bullshit. I’ll say it again. I’ll say it again every fuckin’ time. I didn’t know those guys before that tour. I’d met them, but we weren’t friends. It’s a hugely inspirational record, hugely inspirational band and totally great friends. I’d be a fool not to name that as my favorite tour I’ve ever been on.

Bill – That’s awesome. Given that each member of The Lawrence Arms plays in other bands, and of course has various work-related or family obligations, what kind of future do you see for TLA?

Brendan – The whole world of music is different. The Lawrence Arms is never going to be a sustainable enterprise. It’s never going to be a situation where I’m going to be buying my daughter a jet ski because of all my hard work in The Lawrence Arms, (laughs). That being said, what do we have to lose by staying together? We’re homies and there’s almost nothing on this earth that makes me happier than playing the bass and hearing those two guys bust-in behind me. They’re so unbelievably talented and awesome. I definitely couldn’t get a better band together if I tried. It would be impossible. That’s my dream team. Unless they decide that they’re done with me, I’d say that The Lawrence Arms will be around forever. Who knows, man? It’s hard to say. Music ain’t what it was, man. It’s glaringly obvious and it’s going to get weird very soon for everybody.

Bill – Do you see The Lawrence Arms ever recording another album or doing any significant touring?

Brendan – Yeah, of course. We are going to tour as it’s appropriate. One of the first questions in this interview was about how we used to play around Chicago all the time, and now we play Chicago once a year. We couldn’t play any more than that. It would decrease the value when we play. It’s the same thing with touring. We’ve done the getting our name out there part. Our name is out there. People know us or they don’t. We’re not getting any more popular than we are, maybe here or there. We will continue to of course tour and do what the fuck we do, we just don’t need to and we shouldn’t do it as much as we did. It’ll be more of a natural thing.

Bill – Final comments?

Brendan – San Dimas High School football rules.